Grenades and Medkits!!

please remove this bullshit from the game. You would see, the best players will stop the game sooner or later. Absolutely NOTHING to do with skill anymore!
wauwauwiwaignasInsaneJens_KFShadowWalkerKarajocaKyrusWellyLugaAndy_bandy75TCBRITOaquilaTWDaddictionchevchelliousmaku11RiotZappa[Deleted User]PerlaDiElElgndriaSarge_DrhooJordanYukiMattOfEarthvshield50Hellnight
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Comments

  • wauwauwiwa
    wauwauwiwa Member Posts: 5
    NG STRIKES AGAIN! +1


    noobtools in a nutshell...
    ___InsaneaquilaRiotZappa[Deleted User]romeoMattOfEarth
  • Stalker20
    Stalker20 Member Posts: 1,301 ✭✭✭✭✭
    If you don't like them don't use them, I'm not going to be using them in the challenge, just gw.
    [Deleted User]romeo
  • Jens_KF
    Jens_KF Member Posts: 54 ✭✭✭
    To have them in GW is the worst for me. NG finally made some really cool mapsets, which are not as easy as the challenge and where you really have to think. With medipacks the fun will be gone.

    And in the challenge we will have top scores of 4k+ every week. It just takes by far too much time.

    @Fluxxx : If NG needs more income, find ways to make the challenge harder, so it is more fun again.
    KarajocaADPaqTCBRITOaquilaSteeboon[Deleted User]romeoDrhooMattOfEarthvshield50
  • Stalker20
    Stalker20 Member Posts: 1,301 ✭✭✭✭✭
    @Jens_KF I would only use them when I'm on the verge of losing a sword.
    [Deleted User]
  • tjhookr
    tjhookr Member Posts: 73 ✭✭✭
    @Danski_46 then you will be in huge disadvantage against someone who uses 3 everey mission
    aquilaRiotZappa[Deleted User]romeovshield50
  • Daiiko
    Daiiko Member Posts: 148
    @Jens_KF tu trouve pas que NG ce fait assez de tune ? 🤔 et la solution c'est de rendre le défis plus dur ? Autant faire ce jeu pour les riches!!! Parce que tous le monde n'a pas les moyens que tu as peut-être. Tous tes persos sont a 5☆ roses ? Si c'est pas le cas. Bah donne achete toutes les radios à chaque rafraîchissement et NG te remercieras.
    romeo
  • Stalker20
    Stalker20 Member Posts: 1,301 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Why @tjhookr? GW scores are for completing missions and zones.
  • tjhookr
    tjhookr Member Posts: 73 ✭✭✭
    @Danski_46 you will consider using your grenade in the end when completion hangs by a thread, the other guy who cleared the spikeys and metalheads with 2 grenades will have an easier job for sure
    and this is just considering that the same maps are attempted, with throwing grenades and healing with medipacks the other guy with bottomless wallet can attempt harder maps that would be very risky without tools
    so they will clear harder missions and zones
    it is not hard to see the pay to win aspect of this
    aquila[Deleted User]Picxbamfxvshield50
  • MoreCowBell
    MoreCowBell Member Posts: 20
    NG will get my gold for this week, because of the wild cup. But for me this is a sad day. The thing i enjoyed most is the strategy of the game. Finding tricks. What new strategy is there but to throw 3 grenades at a mission and get through.
    BlackF3vilrineTCBRITOpsychwolfaquila[Deleted User]vshield50
  • Karajoca
    Karajoca Member Posts: 354
    edited May 2020
    I didn't try nor i plan to try them anytime soon, but from description and what i hear ... i don't know who designed this, it's just wrong.

    I mean, idea is ok, something new into game is always welcome but being able to just buy them anytime during mission isn't fair.
    Being able to take down tank, the beast of the game that make us stop from progress with just 2 grenades - ridiculous.
    And on top of all this, tools don't cost us turn, but after throwing we can still move ?! How ? Why ?

    This is not about money, people who pay should be rewarded, should have advantage, all that is fine ... but this is making game so easy and pointless. One update we get reduced grind - next update new powers who allow us to go way further.
    Lady JBlackFTCBRITOaquilajimmydawiseRiotZappa[Deleted User]Chopped_Meatxbamfx
  • Daiiko
    Daiiko Member Posts: 148
    edited May 2020
    Bientôt nous allons avoir le mode "Téléportation" avant cette mise a jour la GW était bien, tous le monde avec ne même nombre d'attaques, les missions des cartes qui reste inconnus, la même difficulté pour tous le monde... Et la ils nous pondent un système débile, enfin pas pour eux parce que le but de cette nouvelle GW c'est de ramasser de l'argent, ils avaient sorti le Bêta pourquoi a votre avis ? Pour voir si ça rapporte de la tune! Pfffffffffff façon c'est la fin de la série il vont nous pondre plein de truc, attendez vous au sabre laser, le gant de Tanos, ou encore la capacité de ce rendre invisible pffffff
    wauwauwiwa
  • IcePeter
    IcePeter Member Posts: 397
    I won’t be spending gold on them or buying bundles. If or when I use a freebie, I’ll probably feel guilty about it 😝
    DaiikoTCBRITOSuperheroNezo
  • ADPaq
    ADPaq Member Posts: 436 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Daiiko said:

    Bientôt nous allons avoir le mode "Téléportation" avant cette mise a jour la GW était bien, tous le monde avec ne même nombre d'attaques, les missions des cartes qui reste inconnus, la même difficulté pour tous le monde... Et la ils nous pondent un système débile, enfin pas pour eux parce que le but de cette nouvelle GW c'est de ramasser de l'argent, ils avaient sorti le Bêta pourquoi a votre avis ? Pour voir si ça rapporte de la tune! Pfffffffffff façon c'est la fin de la série il vont nous pondre plein de truc, attendez vous au sabre lasez, le gant de Tanos, ou encore la capacité de ce rendre invisible pffffff

    I had to use Google translate, but I'm excited to see Thano's gauntlet and teleportation.
    wauwauwiwaDaiikoGradyxbamfx
  • JordanYuki
    JordanYuki Member Posts: 716 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited May 2020
    I like the idea of having tools to help us out when we’re in a tough spot but those tools should be rare enough that we can’t bring some in every missions. Also we shouldn’t be able to buy some mid mission for gold, to be fair the only way to purchase some tools should be in the trade good shop (in exchange for gold) as a one time purchase like the 30 gaz.
    BlackFLoneWanderer360[Deleted User]
  • TCBRITO
    TCBRITO Member Posts: 313 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I agree, that it was a bad idea, it was a big mistake to put them in the game, I am in favor of removing them.

    I think it was the worst update we've ever had in the game.
    ___[Deleted User]Drhoovshield50
  • dalmer
    dalmer Member Posts: 93
    I like to be a devil's advocate.

    Gold in this game is used to fight against "bad luck", so why the arriving of tools not based on probability is not welcomed??

    Outcome of using both medkits and grenades is well defined. There is no gambling. Not at all.
    You'll have exactly what you'd expect in time and place that you'll choose.

    It's lowering the variance in mathematical terms.

    I could describe various scenarios when using them will prevent frustration and make playing more predictable and joyful, but I'll leave it to your imagination. ;)
  • nadecir
    nadecir Member Posts: 271 ✭✭✭✭✭
    This game has been pretty much of a balanced mashup of a little bit of Civilization (build stuff over some time), chess (strategy), slot machine (luck) and Pokemon (collect and buy stuff). The toolkits turned the balance too much toward the Pokemon aspect, and thus minimized the chess and Civilization aspects.

    NG continually adds stuff to buy in the game.
    The game can't survive without it. NG always needs to add new stuff specifically for end gamers to collect and buy in order to go further. The toolkit, with medkits and grenades, is the latest stuff to collect and buy.

    Asking NG to remove the toolkit from the game is a big ask. They spent good time and money to develop it, and they hope to make money from it.

    Perhaps NG should make the grenades and medkits significantly less powerful, and lessen the cooldown restrictions for their use. At least with this, one would have to collect (or buy) more of both to make them more usable for high level missions.

    This adds more strategy for the user of the toolkit versus the current version "blunt pay to win" grenades and medkits. But at the same time still, it stil allows NG to sell them.. One would have to think more about when to use both if they provided smaller buffs. This idea could allow toolkit items to be more readily available in the economy. (crates, quests, GW rewards, etc.)

    This is a change that would require minimal development effort also. It might make the toolkit concept a little more palatable to players if there was at least some strategy involved with these items.
  • WellyLuga
    WellyLuga Member Posts: 3,259 ✭✭✭✭✭
    There needs to be a balance, I know Fluxxx came out and said that they would be monitoring the situation and making adjustments so hopefully they do. With something so strong there needs to drawback but in the current state there isn't one.

    50% damage to any type of walker at any level is ridiculous. The fact that you can do 800k damage to a level 50 is crazy, there needs to be some sort of adjustment to special walkers with massive health. When you blow up a barrel, a grenade walker or goo walker you add 3 threat, grenades add 1? If you want to use a grenade it should cost you an action point. You should have to be selective about when you can use them, not just pay 70 gold when you feel like it.

    Yin without yang. Completely imbalanced and ruins this great strategy game you have created.
    ___ShadowWalkeraquilajimmydawiseLoneWanderer3603vilrine[Deleted User]ADPaqsuzequeue
  • dalmer
    dalmer Member Posts: 93
    > @nadecir said:
    > The toolkits turned the balance [...] minimized the chess [...] aspects.

    You are completely wrong imo.
    KarajocaMoreCowBellFuriousMoldovan
  • ___
    ___ Member Posts: 28
    > @WellyLuga said:
    > There needs to be a balance, I know Fluxxx came out and said that they would be monitoring the situation and making adjustments so hopefully they do. With something so strong there needs to drawback but in the current state there isn't one.
    >
    > 50% damage to any type of walker at any level is ridiculous. The fact that you can do 800k damage to a level 50 is crazy, there needs to be some sort of adjustment to special walkers with massive health. When you blow up a barrel, a grenade walker or goo walker you add 3 threat, grenades add 1? If you want to use a grenade it should cost you an action point. You should have to be selective about when you can use them, not just pay 70 gold when you feel like it.
    >
    > Yin without yang. Completely imbalanced and ruins this great strategy game you have created.

    👍
    [Deleted User]
  • TWDaddiction
    TWDaddiction Member Posts: 487 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited May 2020
    Gotta chyme in as well. I hate that they implemented this. No matter how you look at it, there’s no balance. No matter how you look at it..Throwing a grenade, med kitting, then finishing your action point is a joke.

    Now maybe they add an actual cool down to med kits (like the rpg loading for instance), or maybe they dial back the damage for grenades. I still think it’s possible to fix this, but I don’t know that they will....

    I pushed the last 4 or so weeks just to see what I could do. Made top 50 (top 10 in us) every week. Ive put a lot of money into this game over the last 4 or 5 years, and honestly, it’s people like me that I think NG was targeting to make money off of. I’ll loudly say I will NOT be spending money on this. Out of principle, I don’t like the idea at all.

    Again. I still think there’s hope. But for now, definitely disappointed
    ShadowWalkerTCBRITO[Deleted User]
  • Firekid
    Firekid Member Posts: 3,191 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Is it really any different than someone who goes into a map, sees a bad spawn, or RGG isn’t charged, or goes to stun on their first move and doesn’t get any stun so flees leaves someone behind and pays 26 gold to go again? At least this way everyone will have a chance to use the free ones we get.
    My personal opinion is that it should only be 1 of each type of tool per mission. I said it in the other thread but will say again here. I remember the uproar when they nerfed wrestle trait which could kill any level walker in 1 go and people still moan about its loss. Now we have something which is half as powerful and more expensive (more than close of healing the survivor who struggled to activate wrestle).
    I can see both sides of the arguments though and will be interesting to see if it does break the game as much as people fear. (I mean we’ve had them 2 days so far)
    MoreCowBelljimmorrison369dalmerJordanYukiShadowWalkermack22Stalker203vilrine[Deleted User]Kratossuzequeue
  • jimmorrison369
    jimmorrison369 Member Posts: 2,067 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I'm not going for the top.

    I will certainly enjoy it when I'm in a though spot, I can use my free obtained tool to save the day.
    In stead of waiting 2 hours to heal because I messed up.
    Or lose an attack because I've got a hard mission type on guild wars. (Sometimes you get the spikeys and the gate and the constant spawning)


    I get it, people trying to be on the leaderboards won't like the pressure to compete against someone throwing out grenades and medpacks like they are cookies. (Yes money buys you more stars than before)

    I get it, some guilds will own guild wars with their money (even more then already was of big influence).

    But I don't care about that. I really like to have this free tool available whenever I want. Get me that mm I would still like to finish at the end of challenge. Get me that guild wars save the mission.


    Maybe there should be some restrictions like single use per mission, remove the buy anytime for gold function definitely (that's just perverse).
    But don't Nerf the functionality itself.

    The damage for the grenade is exactly what it should be. The medkit is fine. Having it as extra move is OP but a nice touch.
    dalmerFirekidStalker20BurmeliinisromeoKratosRealClareB8900rpmsuzequeue
  • ATLAS-Z
    ATLAS-Z Member Posts: 6,693 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Yes my original suggestion for consumables was to allow one per mission and it had to be equipped before the mission.

    I had to Shell out some gold to climb up the leaderboard last week. And I know the players above me shelled out even more most of them.

    With unlimited tools at their disposal, I don't know if I'll be trying to keep them company again.

    Maybe they could divide the tools into two categories:

    secondary weapon

    support item

    And then let each survivor equip one of each?


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    JordanYuki3vilrine[Deleted User]
  • TWDaddiction
    TWDaddiction Member Posts: 487 ✭✭✭✭✭
    > @ATLAS-Z said:
    > Yes my original suggestion for consumables was to allow one per mission and it had to be equipped before the mission.
    >
    > I had to Shell out some gold to climb up the leaderboard last week. And I know the players above me shelled out even more most of them.
    >
    > With unlimited tools at their disposal, I don't know if I'll be trying to keep them company again.
    >
    > Maybe they could divide the tools into two categories:
    >
    > secondary weapon
    >
    > support item
    >
    > And then let each survivor equip one of each?
    >
    >

    Honestly this is what I had in mind more so. Equipping before hand and that’s what you have to stick with. No exchanging between each other during mission or using more then what you had equipped.
    3vilrine[Deleted User]romeo
  • LoneWanderer360
    LoneWanderer360 Member Posts: 648 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I didn't realize you could buy one during the mission or that using one didn't take your turn. That doesn't seem right.

    On another topic, if they wanted a tool that people would really like, they should make Lockpick (reduce gate opening by half).
    [Deleted User]ADPaqManselle
  • JordanYuki
    JordanYuki Member Posts: 716 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I like that idea of equipping 1 tool per hero before the mission starts, unlimited tools during a mission and the option to buy them mid mission makes no sense
    [Deleted User]romeo