3.16 Hot Lead Update - Official discussion thread

Fluxxx · May 2021

@Billbam Does it only happen to you guys in a specific mode or team setups?

FuriousMoldovan · May 2021

@Fluxxx
I've seen reports outside of NML forum, including 1 hit insta-struggle of Eugene with 34k health from 47 lvl reg walker. Max crit at 80DR must be 27.4k, correct?
For me, it consistently happened on May 1 and only with Eugene: not only increased dmg but increased frequency of crits too.
Have you looked into Mullet LT maybe?

EDIT - mode GW.
Highest crits for me were:
May 1 - 26k (lvl 45).
May 2 - 19.9k (lvl 45), 33k (lvl 49).
May 2 crits seem to be within the range, but first hit - almost always crit and happening way too often, as if none of Mullet/HS/dodge/luck work.

Billbam · May 2021

Fluxxx said:

@Billbam Does it only happen to you guys in a specific mode or team setups?

GW only as far as I can tell, didnt notice any issues with the challenge, however I also don't use many bruisers there. I will record tomorrow when I play and see if I can find anything specific.

ATLAS-Z · May 2021

Yeah @Fluxxx I can attest, enemies are hitting harder. I know this sort of thing pops up now and then, conspiracy feels, but I think this is legit. Something is off.

SJC · May 2021

@Fluxxx
I have mullet time at 10, 36.9k health , 80DR, lucky staff, 84% chances of avoiding crit hits.I concur ,mullet time was messed up.Instant struggle way too often vs before the upgrade.

WellyLuga · May 2021

I bet it's Negan's trait changes, messing with the system. Since his trait reduces the damage walkers do, that being added might have affected the damage done when it is not in play. In the past one new change you have added has had effects on something that has been in place a while. The badge change in a recent update springs to mind, you corrected the visual rounding error and it ended up messing with the sequence. I don't know the first thing about coding but I have heard it mentioned that you guys are writing new code on top of old code and that has been known to cause unintended errors.

I agree, whilst it wasn't massively obvious at first it did feel a little off and there were several times last week where Eugene got mauled so fast.

Shezza10 · May 2021

I’ve had to drop 2 levels in GW (max 44 down to 42) as I got smashed last week. I lost my first 3 battles which has never happened before and I thought it was just me. Even at 42 I’m having to use Medkits more often. I have to agree with the above.

EngAamie · May 2021

NG pushed another major update? 3.17? whats the change in it.

Novell · May 2021

EngAamie said:

NG pushed another major update? 3.17? whats the change in it.

Bug fixes, i think. Especialy Negan's leader trait.

FuriousMoldovan · May 2021

Fluxxx said:

We may look into some options to address Negan's arbitrary marking in the future. but manual marking is unlikely to happen, as some have pointed out - it would be cumbersome for players to have to mark at the beginning of every turn, and having a setting toggle specifically for Negan is out of the question for us.

@Fluxxx
I understand the complexity of manual marking from UX/dev standpoint and that it's not very feasible.

But making Special walkers his priority in automatic Marking would be a great change, since Negan is not very useful in other cases (outside of Outposts & GW defenders).

Firekid · May 2021

Maybe any special walker within 3 spaces of negan gets marking priority

Winston457 · May 2021

Shezza10 said:

I’ve had to drop 2 levels in GW (max 44 down to 42) as I got smashed last week. I lost my first 3 battles which has never happened before and I thought it was just me. Even at 42 I’m having to use Medkits more often. I have to agree with the above.

OK, so after lurking for a few years I have finally jumped on and registered because of this issue.

I have RGG, Morgan, and Eugene at full DR and 30k+ health and am getting smashed in every GW mission. As others have stated, this is not a conspiracy, there is 100% something wrong.

It needs to be fixed but I do understand that something like this, unintended code issues due to a different code change, isn't always easy to find & fix. I know it can be time consuming and I get it; Take your time to find & fix it properly.

However, in the meantime, how about a Reduced Healing Times event until the issue is fixed? This seems more than fair. Without it, people, myself included, are having to drop tons of gold to heal so they can get their GW missions in.

I'm running two Bruisers per misson (except KAW's) and one, if not both, of them are going to struggle each mission. I then have to wait 2hrs+ after every 1-2 missions, or start dropping massive amounts of gold to get my 18 attacks in.

Would love to hear more from Fluxx, or now Lexia, on what in the heck is going on and when we can expect a fix or a temporary relief measure like Reduced Healing.

P.S. Now that my rant is out of the way, I want to say a huge thank you to the community! You all have been so very helpful over the last few years and I am a much better player due to all of the info on these forums and the YouTube videos of some. Thank you, and I look forward to being a little more vocal now that I have actually registered.

Lady J · May 2021

That is right, something happened with Eugene (my RGlenn and Morgan were huggers before, so didn’t notice with them, but my mullet guy?! ☹️ He is getting into struggles way sooner and faster, and not only in GW mode, noticed that with challenge maps too)... please, check this, because something is definitely off, and with the best bruiser!

Burmeliinis · May 2021

Everybody that is seeing your bruisers getting mauled, please for the love of god, take video of your missions so that we could get some actual, verifiable, proof. Now everything I see is the regular uproar about NG nerfing something after every major update. Usually it's Sasha not getting her charges like before, now it's Eugene getting into struggle.

Lexia · May 2021

We’re still looking into this. So far we’ve investigated DR calculations, Eugene’s LT, and tested out scenarios where Max level Eugene fights lvl 45+ walkers - we compared this scenario in the previous version vs the current (3.15 vs 3.17), and haven’t seen differences.

Since we've had varied reports, could you clarify whether you're seeing higher frequency of critical attack, or higher damage from walkers for all types of attacks - on the technical side, these two very different things, so it's rather unlikely (but still possible) that both have an issue. Or if it is something else that you've noticed, do bring it up!

Would any of you be able to provide any videos or screenshots from 3.15 as well as the current version, where we could check the damage values that you were seeing from high level walkers attacking Eugene, preferably these would also include the exact badge and equipment set-up on Eugene, so we could compare accurately.

If you’re able to provide these materials, please include your name, level and guild name. If you don’t want to post all that info here, feel free to PM me!

Paste · May 2021

I don't have the before/after stats and I'm not really into collecting data or analyzing, but this really isn't normal for me:

https://youtu.be/gERBxaZ7hqo

Both the actual damage and ratio of crits was higher than I thought possible before this update. Now it seems to happen a lot.

My Eugine's leader trait is 7, and he has the infused hazard armor from GW, and near perfect health badges. He has 70% DR from badges and 10% from tactical.

TheKing · May 2021

Here it’s mine from today 😔
https://youtu.be/qy8ZiXcjONY

AlexKom · May 2021

Hi @Lexia! Welcome to the gaming community! I studied all the problems that are associated with the increased damage of the Walking Dead. Now I can not provide accurate data, I started collecting them. The damage of the Walking Dead has really increased since the last update of the game. This problem must be solved and the cause must be found, otherwise I will be ashamed in front of the players of our favorite game for our bouncers, who are becoming useless.

m4s · May 2021

What's changes in Challenge Next week??? @Lexia

fragcandance · May 2021

@Lexia
Congratulations on your new role as the manager of our community. As a head of Red snow/Red machine, one of the biggest TWD NML guild alliances, i expect to receive more detailed answer to the problem I have stated earlier. According to our observations, in this update, the logic of damage accounting was changed. Particularly, the damage provided by melee heroes, as well as zombies, was increased. At the end, as a result, the bruisers as the class have been nerfed. Earlier, typical 4* Eugene with top badges easily survived attack from 50-51 walkers. Now sometimes he can is one-shot fot 47-48 walkers.
Ok, somewhy you've decided to re-consider damage calculation. Why haven't you also boost bruiser health?
We've invested a lot of time and money to make our bruisers true tanks, why should we suffer?

AlexKom · May 2021

I agree with you. Now all tanks in the game no longer survive. If this had been said in the announcement of the update, then there would have been no problems. But no one said about the increase in damage of the walking dead in the announcement. It looks very strange and incomprehensible. Someone cheating players and keeping quiet about it? We need to solve this problem so that there is no talk.

Firekid · May 2021

@fragcandance you got any video of walkers doing more damage than before? We need evidence, to take to them. I agree with you that sometimes my eugene is taking massive damage where before he wouldn’t but it’s never when I’m filming! As a community we need to find some rock solid evidence!

miori199373 · May 2021

@Lexia
@Firekid

What kind of proofs are required?

The logic is following - the damage of walkers was increased but the bruisers were not changed that means they became weaker.

So all efforts we put to make them stronger means nothing now…

There are tables with damage data “before the upgrade”. Everyone can record the video of the damage - just go to the farm missions with a bruisers team.

Firekid · May 2021

@miori199373 that’s the thing, I’ve done just that, looked at the damage tables for walkers that we have and 90% the walker damage seems to match the figures. There does seem to be spikes where it seems excessive but whenever it happens I’m not filming. You say it’s happening all the time so post a video showing a bruiser taking damage from a 45 with what is the expected damage and what was taken.

Firekid · May 2021

So I wanted to check again to make sure I wasn’t talking rubbish and did 2 test runs taking hits. You can see my results and the figures I’ve based the walker damage on. (If these are incorrect let me know). Most of the time there seems to be the usual +\- 10% damage fluctuation but then there are these spikes which I’m talking about. I’ve got the videos to back up the numbers and all 3 survivors are at 80% Dr. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/147_WC5XzjIq1UNRyqi0iGUF6zNoS40RO-aN74DyYayg/edit

miori199373 · May 2021

@Firekid
Past test, I did not record a video, but it was unexpected to watch it.

Firekid · May 2021

That doesn’t really say anything though? How many hits had he taken? 3 crits would send him to red at that level.

miori199373 · May 2021

True🙃

miori199373 · May 2021

@Firekid
The second hit from the zombies and immediately fight.

Firekid · May 2021

So this is what I mean by spikes in damage. next time you probably took 2 crits at normal levels and didn’t struggle. Its why we need videos of it happening because it isn’t all the time.

3.16 Hot Lead Update - Official discussion thread

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